Cleanfire 800 vs Patriot 850

[Nivled]

Did a quick Indy Forum search and didn’t find much discussion. Trying to decide on either a Leftover 800 Indy XC 137 or a Snowcheck 850 Indy XC 137.

Coming off a 2016 Viper and this will be my 1st 2-stroke. I was told the 600 is equivalent to my viper so i ditched that engine. I wanted to know is there a real difference between the Cleanfire & the Patriot or is this just a snowcheck gimmick. I’ve watched quote a fes Youtube videos but there is never a side by side with the same sled. Talked to some dealers but get mixed reviews and seems like they are just pushing floor stock instead of giving fact based answers. I’ve heard:

• the Cleanfire 800 was not too reliable get the more durable Patriot 850 (2 coworkers)
• there really is no diference except the $2k premium for snowcheck (3 dealers)
• coming from your viper the 850 will blow you away (dealer)
• get the 850 if you want but it doesn't hold a candle to the Skidoo 850 (coworker)

New to the forum butt dyno’s are great but I’m also looking for some decent quantifiable data driven info to make my decision. Thanks in advance.

 

[racer487]

I heard that the 850 is having problems. Was told they are blowing up. Dealers are taking care of them the first time then after that it is on you

 

[Rbell14]

Based on some reviews from snow trax TV the 850 sits lower in the sled offering better handling and vibrates less to do how the engine is dampened.

 

[Rbell14]

Here is some good feedback.

 

[Mudgunner]

The 850 is worth the extra cash. It’s producing more power, less vibration and it is dependable. Some people are having issues but all sleds have their own issues. It’s very good on gas for a 2 stroke. I’m not brand loyal and will tell you that the Poo 850 is faster than the Doo 850 completely stock.

 

[OutCast]

The 800s are reliable, last models had some excessive piston movement but last number of years have been good.
The 850 beats the 800s in a drag race. As far as the DOO 850, they are freaking Turtles against the Polaris 850s
It’s actually quite embarrassing for them.

 

[EquillibriumLXXXVIII]

Not to hijack OP question but I just bought an XC 800 137 after riding a Phazer for 12ish years. If the SR-Viper's power is comparable to a 600 2 stroke then I'd hate to see what the comparison was for the Phazer Fx.
Now I thought I did my research and I know I wanted something powerful since I am a big guy so I got the 800 since there were no 850's around at the time and I don't buy first year models. Lately I feel as if everywhere I read the reviews on the 800ho are mediocre. I thought I was in the clear buying into this powerplant after years of refinements since its inception. My dealer alluded to checking engine mounts after 250ish Km but I seem to be reading more about it vibrating a lot and having piston problems (honestly vibrates as much as my 00' Vmax 500) I haven't driven a 2 stroke in eons but I remember how easy it was to whip them around. I am just curious what the opinions are of the 800ho and not just reliability, but power delivery, fuel and oil mileage, etc. etc. Thanks

 

[Lid1]

There is nothing wrong with the 800ho. They improved and made changes from the older 800 in 15. And it kept getting refined. The newest versions of the 800 are really good. And perform as they should. The latest version use the 850 pto end on crank 850 clutch and belt. The capacitor issue sof 15 are long since yesterday’s news. They are really solid sleds . I would have no problem owning an 18 or newer 800ho. Yes the 850 vibrates less , has better engine mounting , and a more robust electrical system. You are in fine shape. Don’t worry.

 

[coryatver]

There are 3 800 class engines we talking about

pre 2015(and newer pro ride models) cfi 800
2015+ 800ho
2019+ 850 patriot

Obviously polaris has greatly improved there motors over the years and the newest motor the 850 has so many improvements over the other ones from taking what they have learned from previous motors and improving on any weak spots. The new 850 is an awesome motor. Any negative feedback about the 850 comes from manufacturing errors a few of them suffered from the first year they came out in 2019.

The cleanfire, well that was a LONG time ago at this point. Some of them ran forever. some didn't lol. Personally I would stay away from a cleanfire and get at least an 800ho, the newer the better. And you will also be getting the axys chassis which is the best chassis ever made in my opinion

• the Cleanfire 800 was not too reliable get the more durable Patriot 850 (2 coworkers)

I would agree with this. Some had no issues and ran forever. But lots of these had issues and newer polaris motors are so much better 800ho,850

• there really is no diference except the $2k premium for snowcheck (3 dealers)

not sure I understand this statement. There are HUGE differences between the 800 and 850. And you could order a 850 snowcheck and pay less then a dealer 800. This model year(2021) the 850 is no longer a snowcheck exclusive. This statement is a dealer trying to make a sale on there floor model because they couldn't get floor model 850s last year

• coming from your viper the 850 will blow you away (dealer)

Yes you are going from 130 hp? to 170. Thats 40 more hp. you will definitly be blown away lol

• get the 850 if you want but it doesn't hold a candle to the Skidoo 850 (coworker)

Thats bs. They are very comparable

• the Cleanfire 800 was not too reliable get the more durable Patriot 850 (2 coworkers)

I think your referring to the 800ho here not actually the cleanfire 800. I think the 800ho was very reliable I would not worry about reliability with the 800. (or 850)

 

[EquillibriumLXXXVIII]

@coryatver & Lid1

I was referring to the 800ho. On other forums like Hardcore Sledder, people were using the words Liberty and Cleanfire 800 interchangeably with only the model years separating the revisions.
As I said in my previous post, I researched the crap out of this sled. The engine has been around for a long time and as another user pointed out it has seen numerous updates throughout its tenure. So with that in mind, I think I was wise buying it now (plus I get the stellar Axys chassis which I hear is the bee's knees) with so few models other than the Titan that offer the 800ho I know Polaris will likely be phasing it out shortly. That tells me that Polaris figures that most buyers will either gravitate towards the 650 for most trail riding and the 850 for the guy who wants all that and the power to be No 1 to the other end of the lake or the guy that likes to scale mountains. I don't know why they are maintaining a 600 with the 650 in existence but one thing at a time. Personally, the added $$ for the extra 40cc wasn't worth it for me to go from 800 to 850 nor were there any around. Everything is selling like hotcakes with the Pandemic putting a damper on people's winter travel plans. You fellas will give me a heck of a lot better insight into these sleds then a dealer would since the dealer is profit oriented. These forums are priceless.
I am actually coming from an 80hp Phazer not the SR-Viper so I will have an actual 80hp difference even though my Phazer likely made a bit more than stock Hp. The Phazer was a 4-stroke tractor..the 800 will be a strung out rocket. I drove an 800 triple triple rammed into a Formula Z body eons ago and had a blast now I'll have my own but I bought the XC for the handling and the new skid too. I have heard that the skis will be caput lickety split without a ski shim job and some better-than-factory carbides. Although I do not intend on studding the track, I figured the extra rail length would help get all those ponies to the snow with minimal track spin.

I do appreciate the replies though. I certainly feel better about my purchase although I am curious what improvements the Matryx chassis brings to the table but intend on keeping my XC.

 

[Doug]

EquillibriumLXXXVIII Stop reading some of the reports. Its like research a head ache by time your done reading everything your terminally ill and have 3 months to live.

There's no problems with a 2020 800. I've got a lot of miles on 800's and have never been stranded or had issues. The engine mounts your dealer is referencing is a minor issue and the engine mounts are easy to change if you need to. They start to take a set and the clutch alignment will be out a little under load. If your not looking at your clutches to make sure they are fully shifting out you will probably not even notice any issues. The vibration that is referenced is really comparing a 800 to an 850. One evolution is the 850 has a complete different engine mounting method which reduces the engine vibration to the operator. Once the 800 is off idle and above slow speeds you won't feel much of a difference between a 800 and an 850.

The ski shimming is also a simple process and I believe there is information on this site for it. If not let us know and we can help you out. What this does is put more load on the back of the ski which helps darting and carbide wear. To go along with this a check of the ski alignment to make sure they are not toed in is worth a check.

Let us know if you have any other questions other on this site will be able to help

 

[Bigfuse]

I heard that the 850 is having problems. Was told they are blowing up. Dealers are taking care of them the first time then after that it is on you

I'm 57 miles shy of 3000 miles and the only problem that I've had was the temperature sensor harness shitting the bed. My buddy is 15 shy of 3000 miles and his temperature harness went south also. The 19's had problems blowing up but Polaris fixed that problem on the 20's. There you heard it from me.

 

[Bigfuse]

I heard that the 850 is having problems. Was told they are blowing up. Dealers are taking care of them the first time then after that it is on you

Not true. When it's on warranty it's on Polaris til it's off of warranty.

 

[SayatodaU.P.eh?]

I would not hesitate to buy a leftover 800. Matter of fact, I’ve almost pulled the trigger a few times this fall on a 2019 800 XC 129 from my dealer, for a screaming deal, to replace my old trail sled. The 850 is a very strong runner and to me, much different in power than the 800. I’ve logged seat time on both.

 

[Lid1]

I heard that the 850 is having problems. Was told they are blowing up. Dealers are taking care of them the first time then after that it is on you

Fake news. You didn’t happen to hear this from a guy with a yellow or green sled did ya ? Lol. There was some issues in 19 that were addressed and 20s were very solid. There was a assembly snafu and a potential mistep in design of crank to case alignment in 19. I don’t personally know anybody with.20 or updated 19 that has lost an engine. I also know a lot of guys that have or had 19s including myself who didn’t have any trouble with them . My 20 has also been no problem. Like mentioned above. Temp sensor jumper but a few guys in the ass I know. But that has been updated also. They are solid. Don’t listen to the haters exaggerations . Oh and yes poo cover them.

 

[Mudgunner]

I just traded in my 19 Indy 850 and it never had any issues. I’d buy it again without hesitation.