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Clutch Talk

Minus40

Minus40

Member
Messages
15
Location
Canada
The thread for setup and mods.
Well guys, threads on oil, spark plugs etc. get a little old so lets talk meat and potatoes. I like to learn so maybe the gurus on here can teach a little.
I'll start with.... belt clearance.
.010....old school or not. Brought forward from the piston port days. Why would it be needed or wanted now?
 
Good post.

Clutching can have a lot of debates.

The meat and bones of clutching is the primary weight and secondary helix. Springs are for fine tuning.

My style of clutching is run as heavy as weights as possible and using the softest springs.

Belt to sheave clearance for trail sleds is better when it's around 0.010"- 0.020" as to much clearance may cause the belt to slip over time/wear.

Gear ratios are a huge player too
 
A very simple mod. Balancing your clutch weights. If you have a decent air compressor, a small digital gram scale, and a small right angle air powered die grinder. Uswe a small roloc disc holder and roloc grinding disc. Make several passes back and forth on the weights sides, staying out of the moon shapped pivot area. Cool the weight in water, dry and reweigh. Continue till you get the weights where you want them. Small simple procedure worth doing.

weight.jpg
 
TO ANSWER YOUR QUESTION ON BELT GAP IN THE PRIMARY ..TIGHTER IS ALWAYS BETTER WITHOUT DRAGGING DOWN THE MOTOR BECAUSE THE CLUTCH CLAMPS THE BELT IN THE LOWEST RATIO POSSIBLE ,WHICH LEADS TO A BETTER RATIO FOR TAKE OFF.
 
DEFLECTION NEEDS TO BE CKED ON A DAILY BASES TO HAVE THE BEST POSSIBLE PERFORMANCE. I WOULD SAY .010-.020 IN THE FRONT CLUTCH BELT TO SHEITH CLEARANCE. UR RIGHT I JUST REREAD MY STATEMENT..LOL I LIKE THE FRONT CLOSE PLUS ITS SMOOTHER ON ENGAGEMENT.
 
I'm not a fan of heavy springs on top in primary or secondary. I like to add the most weight, 0.010" - 0.020" belt to sheave.. I like heavy heel for that initial belt pinch, and tip weight to squeeze belt hard up top.(helps full shiftout)
I'll use a 44 finish angle mostly and work around that.(for fast trail)
A compound initial angle needs to be at least 22 points higher then the finish or it won't work properly.

I machine my clutching to gain a 5- 15% overdrive.

Just more to add
 
Minus40 said:
Which brings up clutch machining. For the drive clutch we have:
-true faces/ cut out dual angle if it has
-true spider clutch post side to rollers then true spring pocket to that
-cut for full shift/ overdrive
-cut spring pocket for needed depth
-true cover spring pocket
-level all weight pads
-balance
Did I miss anything? Does anyone cut the weight pin area for comet style shims right from new?
For the Team driven, anyone want to cover that?
Click to expand...
Explain further what I hilighted
 
IF YOU ARE MACHINING THE TWO SHEAVES SO THAY PUSH THE GATES BELT FURTHER OUT THE TOP ,THE CONCERN IS SPRING BIND. CANT GO BELOW THE 1.19 INCH COMPRESSED .
 
Minus40 said:
Which brings up clutch machining. For the drive clutch we have:
-true faces/ cut out dual angle if it has
-true spider clutch post side to rollers then true spring pocket to that
-cut for full shift/ overdrive
-cut spring pocket for needed depth
-true cover spring pocket
-level all weight pads
-balance
Did I miss anything? Does anyone cut the weight pin area for comet style shims right from new?
For the Team driven, anyone want to cover that?
Click to expand...

The axys 800 is a straight 13.5 degree angle. I'm not saying it's true though.

What are you taking off for depth in spring pocket on spider to get the 1.19"or less??
 
Minus40 said:
Haven't done it yet, sitting on bench . No two are same it seems. Old clutch and new one are .052 different in pocket. I may cut some room in for washers yet, undecided. Did you have to cut much off yours for O.D.?
Still looking for a deal on gates belts. Local napa wants 152 plus tax. Gotta get belts first
Click to expand...
I just measure after I machine and if it's at least 1.19" or more I let it fly.
 
Minus40 said:
IMO tight belt clearance needs to be offset with low initial spring tension and heavy heel weights. Basically
your tightening up clearance promoting belt slip and then have to get grip back with tuning components.
One trail benefit of tight clearance would be the ease on press fit cranks. Any reduction of shock has to be good.

Dr. Your statement suggests deflection would affect that not clearance.
Click to expand...
That's where the Dalton quick adjustable weights come in really handy in my personal use. Div20 I used to have a RacePak on one of my sleds. The starting ratio was 19.99-1 when the clutch first started to grip the belt. Very little surface area to grip the belt there so you'll need weights with a good pinch.
 
Minus40 said:
Which brings up clutch machining. For the drive clutch we have:
-true faces/ cut out dual angle if it has
-true spider clutch post side to rollers then true spring pocket to that
-cut for full shift/ overdrive
-cut spring pocket for needed depth
-true cover spring pocket
-level all weight pads
-balance
Did I miss anything? Does anyone cut the weight pin area for comet style shims right from new?
For the Team driven, anyone want to cover that?
Click to expand...
This has been a qc issue for awhile. The cvt is a huge part of what a small percentage of people are losing rpm.
Anyways, back on topic.

Are you changing the final spring compression of 1.19"?? Or just truing everything up??
 
Took the primary off my '16 Pro-X last night. The clutch bolt was in there very tight, more than the 80 ft/lbs that you usually see. While threading in the puller, the clutch almost fell off the crank stub. Didn't need any pressure to remove the clutch. Never saw that before! Also, you folks that are going to use the Gates belt will more than likely need to reshim the spider, as the Gates is almost 1/16" wider than the 1177 Poo belt. I'll try to get an accurate measurement tonight on the width difference.
 
haulnash said:
Took the primary off my '16 Pro-X last night. The clutch bolt was in there very tight, more than the 80 ft/lbs that you usually see. While threading in the puller, the clutch almost fell off the crank stub. Didn't need any pressure to remove the clutch. Never saw that before! Also, you folks that are going to use the Gates belt will more than likely need to reshim the spider, as the Gates is almost 1/16" wider than the 1177 Poo belt. I'll try to get an accurate measurement tonight on the width difference.
Click to expand...
Don't remember how tight my bolt was on my primary on my 2015, but I do remember that the primary came off with very little trouble.
 
haulnash said:
Took the primary off my '16 Pro-X last night. The clutch bolt was in there very tight, more than the 80 ft/lbs that you usually see. While threading in the puller, the clutch almost fell off the crank stub. Didn't need any pressure to remove the clutch. Never saw that before! Also, you folks that are going to use the Gates belt will more than likely need to reshim the spider, as the Gates is almost 1/16" wider than the 1177 Poo belt. I'll try to get an accurate measurement tonight on the width difference.
Click to expand...
Unless you have already reshimmed the spyder to less than .020 for a oem belt, doubtful you will need to reshim for Gates. Polaris sends these out with .030 to .050 belt clearance oem. With the Gates mine had .018 clearance before reshim.
 
haulnash said:
Took the primary off my '16 Pro-X last night. The clutch bolt was in there very tight, more than the 80 ft/lbs that you usually see. While threading in the puller, the clutch almost fell off the crank stub. Didn't need any pressure to remove the clutch. Never saw that before! Also, you folks that are going to use the Gates belt will more than likely need to reshim the spider, as the Gates is almost 1/16" wider than the 1177 Poo belt. I'll try to get an accurate measurement tonight on the width difference.
Click to expand...
Polaris factory uses a very light film of oil on the crank because sleds sit for long periods sometimes. That's why it was easy with clutch puller .
 
Brock said:
Polaris factory uses a very light film of oil on the crank because sleds sit for long periods sometimes. That's why it was easy with clutch puller .
Click to expand...
Which is kind of strange because I was always under the impression that the clutch must go on dry, or the clutch may turn on the crank causing galling and very tough to remove the clutch the next time.Dunno
 
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