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gates vs polaris belt

HSR said:
I have a very large variety of shims I use,,,some homemade. I can whip up just about any combination. When I index a clutch I don't pick my clearance. I get as close to .015" as I can while keeping the sheaves within the 1" allowed for balance.
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That's what I'm aiming for.
 
racerdave said:
Lot of variance. Measurement's can be subjective though. One guy may put a little more/less pressure on the thumbwheel of the caliper, different calipers also. Kind of like guys all using different compression gauges and having different numbers. My used one only measure .004 less that the one Brock posted above. I am guessing his was new. My new one is .006 wider than his above.
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Yes I agree.
.
There is no denying that fact.I use the same pressure resistance equally on all as I'd only be fooling myself.:cool:

But if you use the same caliper on different belts and find the new polaris belts are consistently 0.050" narrower is a big deal.:rolleyes:

By the way, polaris belts have been no wider then 1.42" for 10+ years brand new. Also making the primary's safe so it only achieves 1:1 at most and no over drive without machining it. Liability comes into play here it seems.

I used to like the old days of wider belts, machine primary to almost make belt flip over. 18% over drive Rockon
 
Brock said:
View attachment 387 View attachment 388

The measurements don't lie.

0.050" wider is huge brand new. I'd say 3+ mph on top for guessamation from my findings over the years.
Will the gate's belt last and take the punishment though?? A few guy's have some miles on these and could chime in .:)

We can't get these in Ontario yet so I bought one from my good friend drnotadoo late in the season and didn't get to test yet. $75.00 us is about $90.00 Canadian. If it works and performs well, I'm going to be a gates buyer.

I do know the Polaris belts for these axys models are inconsistent and I'm not liking them so far on the performance side. If you have a brand new poo belt, I suggest you ride alone for 20 to 30 miles and break it in very easy,(no hard wot pulls). They are way to expensive and need to be broken in lightly.

I'm glad we have some choices:)
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I did break my Poo belt in pretty good, maybe 50 miles, and after around 1000 miles I was loosing RPM, so I changed to a new polaris belt and broke it in like the other one and I got back to 8250. Then I changed my clutching and haven't noticed if I'm losing RPMs yet or not. Not enough time left for me to test. I'm going to try the gates belt and see if I lose RPM. Cause the poo belt isn't cheap!
 
PolarisTim said:
I did break my Poo belt in pretty good, maybe 50 miles, and after around 1000 miles I was loosing RPM, so I changed to a new polaris belt and broke it in like the other one and I got back to 8250. Then I changed my clutching and haven't noticed if I'm losing RPMs yet or not. Not enough time left for me to test. I'm going to try the gates belt and see if I lose RPM. Cause the poo belt isn't cheap!
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If you go to the Gates belt you'll need to use weights that are two grams heavier.
 
racerdave said:
Doesn't that say the Gates belt is even harder than the Polaris belt?
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That would be my way of thinking too.

It can be as hard as it wants, as long as the compound grabs.
 
IMAG0504.jpg
IMAG0503.jpg

As you can see, I like to measure the length of belt too.
 
I think the point of measuring gaps,lengths,compression etc, is use the same tools consistently, and same methods. Slightly Differing numbers from person to person is not a big deal. Doing it yourself consistently over and over gives you your best personal baseline. Hope that makes sense.
 
I also have one of these from SLP.
This is a handy tool. Seems handy for all the 2015 800 HO's as the moveable sheave towers and spider legs are out of spec and chatter while idling.Every 800 HO I've seen and heard chatters from excessive clearance from factory. Spec is 0.001"-0.002" from spider buttons to moveable sheave towers. Most are 0.008" - 0.010" and that's why they chatter while idling. Poor QC again from polaris. Check yours
https://www.startinglineproducts.com/instsheets/20-201.pdf
 
racerdave said:
Ed, thats good to know! Now ,when you had the sheaves cut/refinished by Dan, was it just for a better surface, or did you say you want over drive?

Now, what about the oem belt? Isn't it meant for the 28* sheaves?
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Sorry took so long to reply---it's race season.
I have Dan cut the sheaves so their perfect, and he balances the pieces individually, tucks the weights if they need it, cuts the spider, if it needs it to get correct belt to sheave clearance.

I honestly don't keep track of the sheave angles, I know he told me he cut mine to whatever they've been in the past.
I had no clutching problems!
 
Jim is that Indy Dan? Tucks the weights? Is he cutting the weights heel base, or the heel rest in the clutch?
 
racerdave said:
Jim is that Indy Dan? Tucks the weights? Is he cutting the weights heel base, or the heel rest in the clutch?
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Yes, he cut's the heel rest in the clutch. There is a certain way the weight is suppose to sit in the clutch for best performance, and many don't sit right from the factory. Basically he's blueprinting the clutch. If I remember correctly he charges $150 to blueprint and balance.
 
I e mailed Dan and this is his reply to me about machining and balancing.


Nice sled you bought, I have the same sled.

What's involved - we tear down both clutches, if used we clean, & inspect, replace any wear parts if needed, then machine the drive sheaves, then balance the inner sheave separately, then assemble the drive clutch, then we install the weights and set the belt shimming. Then we remove the weights and final balance the assembly, then reinstall the weighs.

With this type of balancing the drive clutch can be disassembled and re shimmed and never needs to be rebalanced because the clutch was balanced the same way.

The driven is done the same way other then there are no weights and shims to deal with so the driven is cheaper to do.

As for the sheave angles, - the reason I machine them ........

1- The drive clutch shifts faster in the first 50% of the shift travel.
2- the belt runs cooler


I have my CNC set up for the drive angle I like I do not even check them I machine them all.

I have had several Axys drives in here that were multi angle - Mine was one of them.

If you just want it balanced, $75 but it must have a detailed note because we never do it that way and if goes into the system for clutch service it will surely get the full meal deal.

I am building some new clutch weights that I tested last year in my Axys that really worked.

They should be ready in late summer.

THANK YOU FOR CHOOSINGINDY SPECIALTY
Drive clutches are $200
Driven clutches are $75

I would just like to know the angle(or angles) he's machining too,other then that it's all good Rockon
 
Brock thanks for posting Indy Dans reply. I have thought he was high in price but never heard all that he does. Other places I have asked would not balance separately saying they don't have the proper tooling, or it is not worth it. Being able to reshim without having to worry about that indexing bullshit is a big plus. If he is setting belt clearance at .010 or so for a oem, a Gates belt would need reshimming. Does he ask you to send the belt along that you plan to run?
 
[QUOTE=" Does he ask you to send the belt along that you plan to run?[/QUOTE]

The belt width would be much needed.
But, as he explained. You can take apart and reshim (index)without disturbing balance.
I would index the primary to what belt your going to use then send to him.
 
fastsleddr said:
Yes, he cut's the heel rest in the clutch. There is a certain way the weight is suppose to sit in the clutch for best performance, and many don't sit right from the factory. Basically he's blueprinting the clutch. If I remember correctly he charges $150 to blueprint and balance.
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What exactly did he do to change from factory??
 
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